808State Debate - v 3.0 - Contrique/Control

PeteZarustica · Post by **PeteZarustica** » 25 Nov 2005 20:40

Tee-bee or not tee-bee? Here comes the 808State Debate, version 3, oh, 3!

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About Contrique,

one of my fave tracks of all time. I have a few questions...

Did 808 State have access to the open master - i.e. separate, unmixed channels - of the original Joy Division track?

How hard was it to clear the sample? I mean legally.

Did you have a b plan in case of not having the permission to use it (as I've heard it's almost impossible right now, to sample JD I mean)?

Was Control taken from the Gorgeous sessions or was it made specially for State 2 State?

Was it the b plan?

Post by **nickking** » 26 Nov 2005 02:21

I guess that because the band knew Barney and co, then clearing the sample would have probably been a lot simpler than if other bands had requested it?

Of course, only Graham will be able to answer this question!

solarex · Post by **solarex** » 26 Nov 2005 08:50

I never never saw these as the same track. I am quite offended by people linking them. To me the only similarity is the Sinnamon - I Need You Now vocal sampling. And that is used by anyone and everybody before and after. On the source track, just before 'let it take compleeete control' he sings 'let yourself goooooooo'. As in Let Yourself Go.

I am very nearly sure that not a single sequencer pattern of Control is used on Contrique. And non of the instruments used in 89 was in the Contrique setup.

But, both tracks are blinding. Contrique is working and Control is a nice 909 driven demo.

PeteZarustica · Post by **PeteZarustica** » 26 Nov 2005 23:30

Woah, I'm sorry, I didn't mean to offend you. Really.

Yes the only intersection between those 2 tracks is the vocal sample 'let it take compleeete control' - but I though that maybe both of them could have been made during the same time, and maybe, it could be a plan b in the case of a sample clearance fumble. Actually this is ALL theory, pure guessing.

solarex · Post by **solarex** » 27 Nov 2005 09:00

No offence.

Anyway. Contrique might be the first 808 track, where the rhythm is based on samples. The style that was refined in drum'n'bass.

That was my first impression anyway. But giving it a close listen I find it hard to figure the rhythm pattern.

Rodders · Post by **Rodders** » 27 Nov 2005 18:53

i remember receiving a letter from feedback about the release of state to state 1, which gave a brief description of all the tracks, and im sure it said that control was an early demo version of contrique.. unfortunately i don't have the letter anymore. i agree tho that apart from the sample, they are worlds apart. i LOVE the bit in contrique where it kills everything except the riff, and the synth comes through with no delay or reverb on, just a dry waveform.. i think it was the first time i'd heard a completely dry signal on a commercial release! a great track, probably one of the strongest on gorgeous.

808state's Tartan Army · Post by **808state's Tartan Army** » 28 Nov 2005 21:36

To answer Pete Z and Rodders:

According to the sleeve notes on StateToState, Control was a demo track recorded in early 1989 during the Quadrastate sessions.

And a quality track it is too!

newbuild · Post by **newbuild** » 29 Nov 2005 22:28

i have not heard the quadrastate session recording of control...
perhaps it might be included on the rephlex quadrastate cd...
if that ever materialises...

i have read an interview with a guy called gerald where he states that pacific state was one of the two tracks of his he contributed to the quadrastate sessions/peel sessions...
could 'control' be the second?

contrique is my favourite track on gorgeous!

graham · Post by **graham** » 30 Nov 2005 13:26

I had to go and have a listen...
No we did nt have access to the origenal parts ,but it is pretty open on the origenal.
I think we asked Hooky as its his line , but it was all alot easier back then
to get permision .plus we hadnt yet had the post punk revival
The two tracks are not really related we just recycle a lot and of coarse control was in the bin at that point from the quadrastate era its definately got that sound of spirit studios..I think it was considered a bit smooooth
but i like it a lot ..notice the aaaaahhhaaaaaaeeeaahhhaaahh was also recycled later on ex el...accapellas were very valuable .
yet another track Id like to remix ,,actualy begining to like Gorgeous
a bit more..The free disco 12 throughs me a bit
can we have a discusion on that ? is it horably wierd or what and who were we at that moment ..oops best start it on another page

graham · Post by **graham** » 30 Nov 2005 13:30

no gerald was nt on control ,it was just me no martin either i did it when a band didnt turn up one night.

solarex · Post by **solarex** » 30 Nov 2005 14:20

I gave Gorgeous a full listen, almost, Saturday due to this discussion. It's been a while since last time. I must say that I think the album sounded and was a lot better than how I felt about it before.

Back in the days I only listened to the vinyl, but Saturday it was the CD. That might be the reason. The tracks are arranged a lot better on the CD. I had trouble with the vinyl originally, because Time Bomb and Nimbus was known from the EP, and they are in the middle of the track sequence. Also, I never even liked Time Bomb. On CD they are placed lastly with the weak bonus tracks. So up to that point the album works perfectly. Plus the mixing is great. For my living room set-up anyway.

PS. Don't knock Disco Disc. Purple Dust rocks.